Sweet victory: Manu Samoa
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Samoa sent a warning shot to their World Cup Pool rivals with a gutsy performance doing for the Wallabies 32-23 at ANZ Stadium on Sunday.
World rugby's second-ranked team were well beaten by the islanders just a week away from their Tri-Nations opener against South Africa.
The impressive Samoans outscored the two-time world champions four tries to two for their first win over Australia in five meetings.
Alesana Tuilagi, Paul Williams, Kane Thompson and George Pisi crossed for the visitors, with fly-half Tusi Pisi adding 12 points with the boot.
The Wallabies scored a try in each half through Digby Ioane and Matt Giteau, but were always struggling after the visitors had raced 17-0 ahead.
Samoa had never before beaten a top-five ranked country - although they have beaten Wales three times, most notably at the 1991 World Cup.
The scorers:
For Australia:
Tries: Ioane, Giteau
Con: Giteau 2
Pen: Giteau 3
For Samoa:
Tries: Tuilagi, Williams, Thompson, G Pisi
Con: T Pisi 3
Pen: T Pisi 2
Australia: 15 Mark Gerrard, 14 Rod Davies, 13 Adam Ashley-Cooper, 12 Pat McCabe, 11 Digby Ioane, 10 Matt Giteau, 9 Nick Phipps, 8 Ben McCalman, 7 Matt Hodgson, 6 Rocky Elsom (c), 5 Nathan Sharpe, 4 Sitaleki Timani, 3 Ben Alexander, 2 Stephen Moore, 1 Sekope Kepu.
Replacements: 16 James Hanson, 17 Pek Cowan, 18 Dan Vickerman, 19 Scott Higginbotham, 20 Beau Robinson, 21 Will Genia, 22 Kurtley Beale.
Samoa: 15 Paul Williams, 14 Sailosi Tagicakibau, 13 George Pisi, 12 Seilala Mapusua, 11 Alesana Tuilagi, 10 Tusi Pisi, 9 Kahn Fotuali'i, 8 George Stowers, 7 Maurie Fa'asavalu, 6 Taisina Tuifu'a, 5 Daniel Leo, 4 Kane Thompson, 3 Anthony Perenise, 2 Mahonri Schwalger (c), 1 Sakaria Taulafo.
Replacements: 16 Ti'i Paulo, 17 Census Johnston, 18 Filipo Lavea Levi, 19 Manaia Salavea, 20 Brenton Helleur, 21 Eliota Fuimaono Sapolu, 22 James So'oialo.
Referee: Marius Jonker (South Africa)
Assistant referees: Keith Brown (New Zealand), Vinny Munro (New Zealand)
Comments
Tony says...
"hey look at Nicky and Deacon and those other five guys - those are top class Maori (or Pakeha) player"
Deacon is a Maori
Posted 17:03 04th August 2011
WC1969 says...
Jeez, will all of you calm down. If by the current rules you are eligable to play for a country - then you can play for them, no matter where you are from. e.g. just because the Welsh playing Colin Charvis was born in Birmingham doesn't mean could have only played for England!
Posted 17:33 27th July 2011
vitieddie says...
@ Tony
I recall several Samoans who played for Samoa and within a short time span played for NZ (this was in the 90s). I have already stated my case regarding Vidiri. Your point will be migration and roots in NZ and so forth. Fair enough if someone grows up in NZ and wants to play for ABs (e.g. rokocoko). Completely different when someone plays for his country or migrates as an adult and plays for a different country. Again - we have gone over the benefits in terms of money and a better life. On the other hand, this is not beneficial for the island countries and for the fans and for the competitiveness of the sport.
There is another flaw in your argument about NZ-based players turning up in the island teams. Most of them are actually Samoan or Fijian or Tongan. It would be different if you said "hey look at Nicky and Deacon and those other five guys - those are top class Maori (or Pakeha) players - playing for your country ... you're poaching!" ... I would reply "Yea mate ... truzup ... you have convinced me the scales are balanced" ... unfortunately the reverse is (or was) true ... its NZ (and to some extent) Aus - who have actual islanders in them ... I'm not arguing that none of them have not grown up in NZ and call it home ... I'm saying there have been cases where players who represented their motherland or who arrived as an adult have put on the black jumper.
Posted 09:44 23rd July 2011
Tony says...
"but in the PAST has taken the best of the islands. "
I'd just like a few examples. Who are you talking about? Those who played for Tests both for Samoa and the All Blacks were all New Zealanders.
Posted 10:40 22nd July 2011
vitieddie says...
@ tony
I have already stated my points on the issues you have raised. Nicky and Deacon, although excellent players, were not good enuf for the ABs. NZ has such depth but in the PAST has taken the best of the islands. The eligibility laws I spoke about was the one when they made it one person one country. I know recently the islands wanted a change so that former ABs could turn out for them.
On the other hand, many players have found better economic opportunities for themselves and their families in other countries.
All being said, I understand your arguments but we will have to agree to disagree on some issues.
Posted 09:58 22nd July 2011
fozza says...
All good points Tony but do me a favour and don't lump us in as all Brits. I've already stated my outlook on this has been changed thanks to the posts on this website and a bit of outside research. If other people have a different opinion that's there choice but don't paint us all with the same brush (if I had a way of telling Mr Umaga that I would... probably over the phone... in another country!!!)
Posted 21:24 21st July 2011
Tony says...
I should also say that if Fiji wants to do something about its rugby then it should do something about its economy first which has been ruined by years of corrupt military government; a government intent on destroying the countries economic base and driving its hard working ethnic Indian population to all corners of the earth but mainly New Zealand and Oz. This would secure a better future for Fiji and would vastly benefit its rugby. Instead the country sinks further into the morass. On this note and as a complete aside you may be interested to know that the current NZ governor general . Rt Hon Sir Anand Satyanand, is part Indo Fijian.
Posted 17:59 21st July 2011
Tony says...
And I quote Tana Umaga
"As a Pacific Islander, I have an interest in, and a concern for, Pacific Islands rugby. There are two issues: the nonsense the British media keeps pushing about New Zealand poaching players from the Pacific and the very real plight of rugby in the islands at both grassroots and international level. My parents emigrated from Samoa; I was born in New Zealand. There are some All Blacks who were born in the islands but came to New Zealand as children. Their parents brought them here for education, to give them the opportunity of having a better life than they had.
My parents made sacrifices for their children; I may be a public success story, but a lot of that is due to them. All their children have benefited from the sacrifice they made by leaving their homes and families in Samoa to make a better life for their children in New Zealand.
Our parents sacrificed to give us opportunities and for some of us those opportunities were in rugby. A few became All Blacks: we had the opportunity to play for the best team in the world and earn a living doing it, and we took it. Wherever in the Pacific Islands you come from, when you¿ve lived in New Zealand for any length of time the All Blacks are your first choice. I don¿t take these things lightly; I did it because I loved it and I knew that it would make my parents proud. Whether you¿re Pacific Islander, Maori or Pakeha, you want to make your people proud of you, especially those who looked after you and sacrificed for you when you were young. That¿s why I get angry when they go on about poaching.
The Brits have a crack at us over poaching because they can¿t have a crack at us over the way we play the game"
And so say all of us!
Posted 17:15 21st July 2011
Tony says...
"if the eligibility rules had not been tightened - there would be more islanders switching allegiance"
It was the NZRFU who tried to get the rules loosened to enable guys to move from teir one down to teir two (I assume this is what you are talking about). It was blocked by Ireland et al.
Sivivatu came to NZ to go to Wesley College on I believe a soccer scholarship. I also understand that he played little rugby until he came to NZ. If he chooses to play for NZ then so be it. He is exercising freewill just as all the kiwis who have played for Ireland, Scotland, England and Wales have done.
Nick Little I believe is a 3rd generation NZer; Deacon Manu is also NZ born and part Maori and thus has ancestral connections in NZ go back almost 1000 years. Isa Necewa is also a kiwi who has part Fijian lineage. I do not here claims that these guys have been lured to play for Fiji or other pejorative statements.
As for allegiance you clearly think that guys of Polynesian lineage who live in NZ could not think of themselves as being kiwis (its always that given the right circumstances they would be playign for Samoa, etc). It does not say much about NZ, a society hugely influenced by immigration and one which for its ongoing success has focused and must continue to focus on assimilating those who come to live there. They way those from the north focus on this is hypocrisy on a huge scale when sports teams from the British Isles are crammed full of children of immigrants from the West Indies, Africa and the sub-continet. Tell me was Nasser Hussain or Owias Shah (both born in the sub-continent) lured to play for England? Was Victor Ubogu or Erinle (born Africa) cajoled into doning the English jersey? What about the British Olympic team; it must be hugely detrimental to almost every sport that all these kids are not competing for ........you name it!
Posted 17:11 21st July 2011
Carpelone says...
Italy bullied by Refs is a bit too much, it is fair to say that they were often kind of patronising.
Having said that, Italy are still their own worst enemy, since they blew some very good chances to win few more games in the 6N. last one, this year in Rome against Ireland, leading by 1 point, 1 minute to go and ball in hand.
Posted 16:19 21st July 2011
vitieddie says...
@ Tony
I didnt question Rokocoko's allegiance - you brought it up and again quoted to back up your claims - preaching to the choir? ... What about Sivivatu? He certainly didnt grow up in NZ and by the time he made it in super rugby he was lured by the black jumper. Now, as I said - theres good and bad - certainly the financial benefits are there but for the fans of fiji and the competiveness of the game its detrimental. As for Samoa - I already said it seems they have benefited from their close relationship to NZ. This is not the same for fiji. As for Nicky - I dont think he played for NZ in 7s or 15s. Deacon Manu, after knocking on the ABs door for so long, finally put on the white jumper. I stand by my statement on the past - if the eligibility rules had not been tightened - there would be more islanders switching allegiance. And as I also said, these days it does not matter. Players get the chance to ply their trade in europe and japan as professionals - it comes down to their attitude and the team management on game day ... and the islands continue to be poor thus migration to NZ/Aus will always be a reality.
Posted 14:41 21st July 2011
GCP_JONES says...
Hi Crunchfit,
Italy not bullied by Refs, your wide off the mark there,
2007 World cup warm game, Ireland v Italy at Ravenhill, O'Gara was clearly held up by the Italian Hooker, but the ref and TMO bottled it and awarded the try, Italy lost by 2 points.
Posted 09:07 21st July 2011
crunchfit says...
@sandal "And if they aren't bullied by the referees, as Italy has been so dreadfully bullied by British Isles refs."
Not really true at all...
Posted 22:18 20th July 2011
fozza says...
That's an interesting comment from the Rocket man and surely that kind of puts everything to bed? There's another story on planet rugby where Hendrie Fourie states he is proud to play for England and gives it his all.
Personally, I'm a very proud Englishman who has lived in Scotland for 13 years (christ didn't realise it was that long!) and I've even captained a Scottish Touch Rugby team in a Civil Service competition. I'm proud to be English and love the country of Scotland (even if it's not reciprocated!!!).
Posted 17:38 20th July 2011
Tony says...
Vidiri came to NZ before the game went professional and spent more than 3 years playing for Cantabury before he qualified as an All Black. Perhaps you would like to explain to me Nicky Little and Deacon Manu (who as you may recall has played for NZ Maori).
If you are question Joe Roco's allegiance then perhaps you might be interested to read this statement from him:
" Rokocoko, who admits that the decision to commit to the All Blacks and New Zealand rugby was easy.
.
"As a kid, I always watched the Sevens and wanted to play for Fiji in Sevens. Once you get older and you start to concentrate on 15s, the All Blacks take over.
"There were some people who thought I should have played sevens for Fiji and not New Zealand, but after the Super 12 it all changed. In the end, it has worked out well and it was a thrill to get that black jersey on."
Rokocoko, resident in New Zealand since he was five, considers himself fortunate to claim a bit of both cultures. "I'm proud to be Fijian and I am proud to be a Kiwi.
I go back to Fiji often and I still speak Fijian. A lot of Fijian kids in New Zealand don't even speak their own language."
Posted 16:25 20th July 2011
Tony says...
What was more prevalent in passed years? Have you not read anything we have said? Samoan players in NZ are by and large New Zealanders. They do NOT come to NZ to play rugby. Samoans come to NZ to escape the poverty of subsistence agriculture, to improve their life chances and those of their kids, Rugby has nothing to do with it!
As for the relative benefits of players of Island heritage playing for NZ I have no idea what you are on about really. Samoan migration to NZ is a reality and if those immigrants choose to play for NZ and see themselves as Samoan New Zealanders (as they rightfully should having come through the NZ system) then so be it? This is part of being assimilated into the culture/society to which you have moved.
And please cut this rose tinted view of the Pacific Islands. Tonga and Samoa are poor and will increasingly shed population to NZ and Oz. They are hamstrung by hopeless economic management and dependent on remittances and aid mainly from NZ. Unless they reform their economies, and in particular breakdown issues concerning land ownership and property rights they will continue to face relatively poverty brought about by subsistence agriculture
Posted 15:29 20th July 2011
vitieddie says...
Ok this is my two cents:
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Island players
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This was more prevalent in the past. I recall players like Vidiri bursting onto the sevens scene and then donning the black jumper the next year. The best of the best got picked by NZ (and Aus) and the Islands got the players not wanted or were past their prime. I believe this has hampered the competiveness and development of the island nations. It has certainly been painful for Fiji fans to watch their own compete and win matches against their own country men. Of course, people living in or have close ties with NZ would disagree. Accordingly, Samoa has benefited more from NZ than the other two nations. Is it beneficial for the players? Yes it is and good for them. Some of the players make good money and get opportunities for a better life. Is it beneficial for the islands and their fans? I dont think so. After all, when the ABs win its the NZ flag being raised, not one of the Pacific Islands. Is it a major issue now? Not really, watching Fiji play - it seems the hinderance to their progress are the players and officials themselves.
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Arrogance
*************
Before the Samoa test, I didnt hear any talk of disrespect. There were some news of Aus riding the success of the reds but not of winning the world cup. And the TV commentators were fine. I've heard worst from NZ commentators during the sevens. I dont see where all this Aus bashing coming from. Its funny but on the flip side - aussies seem to think NZ fans are arrogant. A fren of mine visited NZ recently and people were openly boasting that NZ is the best in the world and would win the cup. I agree but theres no need for chest thumping. And note that rugby in aus ranks a poor second to league, AFL and cricket. Its a wonder they have been successful in union.
Posted 14:41 20th July 2011
Tony says...
"since we are on the topic of player poaching please explain the cases of sivivatu, rokocoko, tomasi cama jr, rikabula "
Joe Rokocoko came to New Zealand when he was 5 years old. He is a New Zealander.
Sivivatu see below.
Tomasi Cama - Born Suva Fiji 11/11/80 Came to NZ on secondary school scholarship
Lote Raikabula - Born Fiji 31/07/83 Came to NZ in has teens and went to Tawa College Wellington
Posted 09:43 20th July 2011
GCP_JONES says...
Hi Sandal,
Thanks for your response, with regards to the drain on players. Here in Irealnd while Rugby has started to grown beyond its traditional strongholds, it is still somewhat behind in player numbers , from Soccer, and especially our native sports of Hurling and Gaelic Football,(there are over 4,000 clubs playing Football and Hurling, compared with about 350 Rugby clubs)
What the Union have done here in Ireland, is to centrally contract players to the union and not the provinces, along with a government ploicy of offering tax breaks to professional sports people.
This has resulted in many of the players being able to stay playing in Irealnd and not heading to France say.If Racing-Metro are willing to pay 1,000,000 Euro's a year for the totally over-rated S. Chabal imagine what someone like Jamie Heaslip would earn.
Totally agree with you on Italy they have lost more games as a result of bad refs than there own shortcomings, I'm more concerned about that match in the pool stages than the out-come of the Australia game .
Posted 09:04 20th July 2011
vitieddie says...
@tony ... there IS a pacific islands nation ... its called NZ ... too bad the anthem, jersey and flag does not reflect this ...
since we are on the topic of player poaching please explain the cases of sivivatu, rokocoko, tomasi cama jr, rikabula ... i am not arguing or being cynical ... i want your view on this in terms of the big picture taking into account the development and competitiveness of the island nations
Posted 05:10 20th July 2011