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- England Fixtures
| Fixture | Details |
|---|---|
| All times are local | |
| International Match | |
| Sunday , May 26 | |
| England vs Barbarians | 13:00 |
| Sunday , June 2 | |
| Consur XV vs England | 19:30 |
| Saturday , June 8 | |
| Argentina vs England | 20:10 |
| Saturday , June 15 | |
| Argentina vs England | 20:10 |
| More International Match fixtures | |
- Table
| Pos | Team | P | Pts |
|---|---|---|---|
| 1 | Wales | 5 | 8 |
| 2 | England | 5 | 8 |
| 3 | Scotland | 5 | 4 |
| 4 | Italy | 5 | 4 |
| 5 | Ireland | 5 | 3 |
| 6 | France | 5 | 3 |
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Comments
Nicholas41 says...
Oops - sorry. Thought his was a cooking blog...
Posted 23:01 13th June 2012
new_j4a says...
"Stellenbosched2, Aren't those the right words? I'll have to listen at the start of test number 2. By the way, did the 2 saffas we loaned England manage not to sing the South African anthem? I missed the pre-game show.
Posted 09:15 10th June 2012
Stellenbosched2 says...
Hi new_j4a
Did you mean to say 'God Shave the Queen'? Lol. Poor JayStarr, he may have a different thought in mind when singing the anthem.
Hi Pikes
As a fellow Stormers supporter I understand your frustration, but please, when it comes to the Boks nothing else is important(unless you are one of those Cape Crusader traitors). As they run onto the field I am so tense with pride..yes tense. A Bok test is way to stressful to be enjoyable for me. I would have to agree with Herbmans reply to you.
Posted 07:19 10th June 2012
sandal says...
@APV1, kybone and melkdave
Thanks for your clarifications -- that sounds much better to me. I think some of you, at least, have revised your positions since your original statements here. Perhaps, in your initial enthusiasm for Phil Vickery's column, you overstated your positions.
I don't think it's honest of us to dismiss our defeats before they happen. Those of us who argue that only world cups matter are not only being dishonest with ourselves, we are undervaluing the game. A hundred thousand people don't turn up in Soweto or Sydney, 80,000 in Cardiff or London, when the result doesn't matter. I'm sure you're with me on that.
Posted 01:56 10th June 2012
Voice says...
@Pikes - you sound like one of those typical jaundice eyed SAFFAS that has nothing productive to contribute so you just spew your own inscure rubbish all over. We will never have the perfect bok coach or players - there will always be happy & unhappy fans. The most important thing is back your team that is the difference between being a fan & a supporter!. Am I happy with the squad?? No but they are the Bokke and that is all that counts.
Posted 14:44 09th June 2012
meneer says...
Really well written article Phil, looking forward to the rest. As a Bok supporter I value your open and honest approach, but remember you are allowed to be a little bias and show a bit more support to your team - it's expected.
Posted 16:14 08th June 2012
new_j4a says...
@grokling ...100% agree. Same goes for JayStarr the PDV and John Smit apologist. You are not a Bok supporter because you want them to lose. I assume that JayStarr still has an old England rugby jersey left over from his UK time? Wear it on Saturday and sing "God Shave the Queen"
Posted 15:00 08th June 2012
melkdave says...
@APV1
I think you put the england supporters position better than i did lol,To Jonsey2 and Sandal to suggest trhat any losses dont hurt is wrong they do,but for once we english are being realalistic .Our team atm are not world beaters we need to develop and make progress on a new style/ gameplan .Also i too think come 2015 the squad and team may be alot different than it is now.As Kybone says we have a wealth of good young talant atm ,all or most who are capable of stepping up if given a chamce.One reason im watching the JRWC matches atm is to try and spot them lol.Hopefully England will be making progress every year and beating the likes of Australia -S.Africia and even New Zealand often along the way to RWC 2015.But im realistic enough to know that we will lose matches along the way aswell,against them and others .Though hopefully not many LOL
Posted 14:21 08th June 2012
ZAoorALLES_4E says...
@Pikes! Traitor!
If there were not so many injuries to key players and the U20 JRWC there would have been lots more stormers and you know it!
The team selected was for this England tour only and will differ quite a lot come 4 Nations... Obviously! Smuck!
Posted 14:06 08th June 2012
new_j4a says...
@jonsey2 who says "so england are conceding defeat? thats not going to help in the long run or immediately. thats where england go wrong and thats why i cant begin to comprehend "...the POMs are not Australian and so not braggards who find it necessary to post the arrogant kind of bullsh!t you posted prior to the lesson in humility that Scotland gave you....or tried to give you...you personally seemed to have skipped class that day? From your quote, only a few words come even close to describing the real situation....these are here you say (of yourself)..."i cant begin to comprehend "
Posted 13:34 08th June 2012
grokling says...
@pikes "As a Springbok supporter I hope the English beat the Springboks!"
If you want the Springboks to lose then you ARE NOT a Springboks supporter. You are a Stormers supporter.
Grow up.
Posted 13:09 08th June 2012
Herbman says...
@pikes, come now... I'm a Stormers supporter to the hilt and I agree with the selections HM has made. Gio = too small, Kolisi = too young, Grant = better to go with the Hougaard/Steyn combo, J de Jongh = didnt deliver this year at all (in a non-performing Stormers backline).
Super Rugby is over for the moment, forget about who got selected or not and support the Bokke!
Posted 12:32 08th June 2012
pikes says...
As a Springbok supporter I hope the English beat the Springboks! Heyneke Meyer aka Heineken is the first SA coach that has an oppurtunity to choose so many coloured players on merit and he chooses only 3 Stormers who by the way who is 2nd on the S15 log the Sharks who is 7th gets 11 ...pretty stupid...but we Stormer supporters knows he hates us! and yes South Africans value hard rugby!!!! i think the Stormers showcases that the best with there brutal defence ... The Bulls try to play a more attacking brand of rugby, Yes , but it doesnt suit them...every try they score looks sloppy. So if we wanted to play old traditional style of rugby we should have chosen Peter Grant ( Best flyhalf @ the moment ), Juan de Jongh (Best defensive backline player in SA ) Gio Aplon ( Best Ballrunner) Heinrich Brussow ( Best Fecther ) and Siya Kolisi ( Best South African player next to Eben Etzebeth ). Heineke Meyer it must have been akward when the Stormers side beat the "Springboks" in there own backyard.
Posted 10:37 08th June 2012
ummagumma says...
Sorry, but re-reading Phil's piece, it clearly, catagorically says that results ARE important. Call me pedantic, but I cannot see where it says anything else. It does say that other factors have greater importance than perhaps they would in other scenarios.....and I think that's an honest and accurate comment.
Posted 10:09 08th June 2012
APV1 says...
@ sandal & jonesy2 et al - don't get me wrong, I'm hoping for a win tomorrow and for the series. But I'm a realist too and know that SA and NZ are better than us at the moment, despite the negativity towards the Boks.
We're not conceding defeat, just having a realistic outlook and a goal for the future.
Have another read of melkdave's comment, as he sums it up nicely. We want to progress and develop, as we are aware that we're not world-beaters at the moment. To suggest otherwise is delusional and nonsensical. We know who we should beat and know who we're likely to struggle against. We have a publicised goal of winning the 2015 (home!) RWC, so everything between now and then are building blocks.
Just like in 2001 - 2002, when we were THE force in world rugby. By the time we won the RWC in 2003, we had gone over the crest and were on our way back down again (or, perhaps, others were overtaking us). We want to be peaking in the Autumn of 2015, not in 2013 or 2014. On the way, we want to be beating everyone, of course, but a loss to the Boks at this stage of our "journey" is not the end of the world.
Do I want England to win every match? Of course I do.
Do I expect them to win every match? Of course not.
Will I be hoarse form cheering them on in every match? Of course.
Will I be disappointed with any losses? Of course.
Is the RWC in 2015 more important than this tour? Yep.
Posted 09:35 08th June 2012
kybone says...
sandal i don't think that the England fans are saying that losses don't count. What they are saying is that, having started almost from scratch after the World Cup, defeat on this tour wouldn't be a disaster at this stage as we're anticipating gradual improvement over the next 3 years. Of course we want to win. I personally think we can win and i certainly won't accept defeat with a smile on my face. This England side is very much a work in progress and even though its still young, it could look very different in a few years time as there are shed loads of players good enough to claim a spot given the chance. The Bok team for saturday on the other hand, however much the Saffas want to claim it to be brand new, is made up largely of players that have been there for years.
Posted 09:12 08th June 2012
sandal says...
@jonesy2
I agree with you. It is 2012.
People who say things such as ""2015 RWC is our current goal and everything in the mean time is a useful tool and stepping-stone towards that"" are admitting they support a second-tier team.
Top-tier teams don't have the luxury of saying such things. For them, a loss is a loss is a loss, whichever year it occurs. And teams that beat them take their success as a win.
Should England win this series, don't anyone tell me that Phil Vickery, APV1 and co will not be celebrating. For the likes of these people, it appears it is only the losses that don't count.
Posted 07:50 08th June 2012
jonesy2 says...
so england are conceding defeat? thats not going to help in the long run or immediately. thats where england go wrong and thats why i cant begin to comprehend how the supporters feel. its 2012 not 2014 or 2015. the great teams are never in bullsh**t "transition" phases.
Posted 05:29 08th June 2012
ruckingkiwi says...
Good article, summed up the South African attitude to rugby perfectly.
However, do not understand the "results" garbage towards the end, I thought self-belief was key? Play to win every game, every time and everywhere, not with one-eye on 4 years time. Totally different mindset than what we're used to.
Posted 01:51 08th June 2012
Houston_11 says...
Agree with APV1 - great article but please don't commentate on it!! Really lookin forward to this series - very intriguing teams. Personally, I would have loved to see George Ford go and get a go at 10 with Farrell at 12, which I think is his best position.
Anyway, let's hope we get some good attacking rugby - England certainly have the flair and ability lacking from Johnson's reign.
Posted 19:32 07th June 2012