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Comments
rugbylover says...
As lawynd (I am assuming some legal background to the name?) may be able to tell you, 'innocent until proven guilty' is a legal concept ¿ not necessarily moral, nor even factual.
'A 'may have committed this crime but, until you can PROVE it, 'A' is deemed to be innocent. In English law, the prosecution must prove the case, it is not up to the defendant to 'prove' his innocence - he has the benefit of presumption.
One can see a crime committed & be certain that the culprit is ¿guilty¿ in the sense of responsible. But he [or she] is not legally guilty until proven to be so. It does not mean that the accused didn't do it , merely that he/she hasn¿t been proved to have done so. That is why, for example, a person who is seen [known] to have committed a murder would not [in most cases] be granted bail, although technically they are innocent [as in ¿not yet (or maybe) convicted¿].
Posted 13:45 19th June 2012
APV1 says...
In the business I work in (and others before), employees are suspended for alleged acts of Gross Misconduct. They receive full pay and benefits, but may not work until the matter has been cleared up. Innocent until proven guilty? Yes. Suspended during the investigation into their alleged misconduct? Absolutely.
And just the fact that there is an allegation at all brings the game into disrepute. I, for one, am glad we have SL at the helm who is not accepting this sort of thing, rather than Dingo who does.
I think you'll find I have been equally scathing about Care et al, as these chaps, Guildford, Henson and others. They all represent a sport I love and I want that representation to reflect professionalism, not "old school" amateur rugby tours.
Posted 11:16 19th June 2012
lawynd says...
@jonesy2 - about the same time you and the other trolls on this site adopted a double-standard about how you view players from different countries.
Posted 10:13 19th June 2012
new_j4a says...
I want to see him play....distasteful as it is to be on the same side of anything as jonesy2....I do think that he is innocent until found guilty.... (He and Cooper really do need to do more to prop each other up morally?)
Posted 21:45 18th June 2012
rugbylover says...
But how appropriate!
Unoriginal - sorry - too much exposure to tripats 1 & 2.
Posted 16:43 18th June 2012
APV1 says...
@ RugbyLeRoux - I suppose you're right. And Lancaster explained right from the outset to the RFU that he wouldn't accept any nonsense. The RFU have also given SL a little more leeway to lose matches, as long as they're is improvement. And there is, match-on-match, improvement and plenty to take away.
Don't get me wrong, I rate Beale highly, as one of the best 15s in the business at the moment. But I'm glad we have SL taking a firm stance, as England rugby needed it and it's being effective.
Posted 16:18 18th June 2012
jonesy2 says...
chaps, when did the notion of being innocent until proven guilty go out the window? look at you blokes condeming him. none of us know what he did or didnt do and until he has been sentenced in a court of law he is free to put wales to the sword if he is picked to do so.
Posted 15:56 18th June 2012
RugbyLeRoux says...
His principles are that he wants to win and not get fired.
Posted 15:12 18th June 2012
APV1 says...
Massive difference between Dingo's attitude and Lancaster's. Care was banned from the 6N before anything had been decided, where-as Dingo wants him to play.
It's a shame, as principles are what make us the men we are. Where are your's, Dingo?
Posted 12:57 18th June 2012
daibok says...
If Beale is fit and plays 15 then I cant see that Wales have any chance unfortunately. Aimless kicks will be punished remorselessly.
Posted 11:22 18th June 2012
melkdave says...
[Personnally if i was Deans ,i wouldnt pick him ,but then disapline seems lacking atm.England and New Zealand have had this kind of trouble ,and thankfully now seem to be on top of the situation.Players it seems only respond when their careers are threatned.Its a shame it comes down to that imo,as they are supposed to be responable adults
Posted 10:47 18th June 2012