Not impressed: O'Neill
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ARU boss John O'Neill has responded to NZ coach Steve Hansen's claims that Australia are stealing players as being "insulting and ill-informed".
Hansen made the assertion after the world champions' 18-18 draw with the Wallabies on Saturday in which New Zealand-born centre Mike Harris kicked five penalties for Australia.
The All Blacks coach says Australia should concentrate on developing their own talent, rather than trying to build depth by "pinching" New Zealand players.
O'Neill said New Zealand should put their own house in order before criticising Australia, adding "the comments from the All Blacks coach are insulting, ill-informed.
"I would not even want to guess how many players born in the South Pacific islands have worn the All Blacks jersey," he said.
Comments
Trinats2 says...
Trader2:
Your kids, who would they play for ? AUS or NZ ???
Posted 10:05 24th October 2012
hybrid187 says...
Bottom line is Australia (a nation of 24mil) is guilty of stealing athletes from NZ (a nation of 4mil).
End of story.
The Aussies like to think the ABs are full of Islanders, in reality all these 'Islanders' were actually born in NZ and/or learned how to play rugby there. Australia poaches people because 'a grandparent' was born there. Thats not a good enough reason for me personally, and im sure many millions more.
Australian Rugby Union and Australian Rugby League do NOT have a leg to stand on here, O'Neill, do some RESEARCH first please.
I think maybe theyre a bit embarrassed ? Aussies are proud sportsman so having all your best players born overseas can be a bit deflating I guess.
Posted 09:03 24th October 2012
Ferdie says...
Kiwi_Ruck says Two words Steve Devine
Wow, huge depth to that comment. Care to explain?
SD played 148 matches for Auckland and Blues; in NZ 4 years before AB selection and 10 tests. Moved to further his rugby career in NZ - I understand he still lives there 5yrs after retiring from rugby. Where's the suggestion he was paoched. About same time two Australians came here (Taranaki) to play in NPC Cup (James Hilgendorf and Brock James) good on them, and they chose to go back to Australia and got Super contracts there - the experience helped their careers, i see James is still doing well in France. Professional game, players make choices - none were poached that I can see.
Posted 08:12 24th October 2012
Trader2 says...
KoolJay very eloquent and 90% correct however you again miss the main point, the AB's with Island heritage have not moved to NZ for education or players contracts they were all born there, possibly their Mum's and Dad's were born in NZ maybe even their grandparents were boirn there. They are Kiwi's with island heritage, just like I am a 3rd generation Kiwi of English heritage (can't help bad luck - just kidding). There has been no talent lost to the islands, they never had it in the first place. Can you understand that, John O'Neill and some others obviously don't.
Posted 22:59 23rd October 2012
Trinats2 says...
Well it's working.
A 3rd String Aussie side made up of players from around the world drew with the current world champions.
So I guess a full strength Aussie side is really "WORLD" champions !!!!
Jammyguy:
Lets start with your 7s !!!
7s doesn't mean you have to have 7 different nations represented in one team !!!
Posted 22:57 23rd October 2012
jontheref says...
jmanngod
Gallagher went to NZ for a career.
he had been playing 3rd team Rugby before he left.
he was a late deveoper.
Good luck to him.
he would probably still be playing rd team rugby if still in England.
Posted 22:24 23rd October 2012
Kiwi_Ruck says...
Two words: Steve Devine
Posted 22:11 23rd October 2012
Ripzy007 says...
I think most of the island players develop their rugby in NZ or were born in NZ...Quite different from this Oz Super Teams bringing in players from NZ who played and developed their rugby skills in NZ...Two very different scenarios I think..
Posted 21:42 23rd October 2012
kiwilad says...
Very defensive reaction, I wonder why that is???
Posted 21:33 23rd October 2012
KoolJay says...
The arguments and statistics are incredible and true,makes me marvel at how 3 little group of Islands in the Pacific Ocean can be so influential in the sphere of our Great Game.Yes they were born in NZ,Aus etc,they choose to play for X country and yes they have evolved into amazing players under the guidance of the big nations.The fact remains they have Pacific Origins and that makes them special. They were born to be a bit slicker, faster and give bone crunching tackles like there was no tomorrow than most.Sounds familiar? yes! That is rugby! and why they fit perfectly into the Great Game.All these countries taught them was a bit more knowledge and the technicalities. Along the years there is the unmistakable portrait of who they are first and foremost, Islanders.Commentators and writers alike always depict them as Samoan,Tongan or Fijian born or ancestry somewhere in their commentary or literature.Funny how Kiwis and Aussies analyse and throw statistics into the bowl about preference of choice and birthplace.It does not compensate for the raw talents that men from these small islands have brought to their shores and their game.How they love to run with the ball,the ease at which they pass,the ferocity of their tackles,how they enjoy rugby like it is still a game that entertains and not a playground of boredom,bitterness,animosity and politics.Hence the 9-3 try less games which is making rugby less attractive and boring to watch.Being called an All Black or Wallaby did not make them legendary it simply unleashed their talents and put them into the limelight.It is common knowledge in the Islands when someone moves overseas for education,playing contracts or emigrates there's always a farewell knowledge that talent lost to them is NZ and Australia's gain.As for me I say we acknowledge,enjoy and be grateful to such colour's they bring and paint into our Wonderful Game.
Posted 19:44 23rd October 2012
jmanngod says...
@Tubolardy. Bunce doesn't even have Samoan ancestory. He was poached FROM NZ. Gallagher went to NZ on his own steam to better his rugby. No one asked him to come.
Sincero (I'll put your grasp of Irony down with that of Alanis Morrisettes shall I?)
Posted 19:24 23rd October 2012
jmanngod says...
Trinuts - wrong again. This case has been answered too many times to worry about. Which Fijian? Rokocoko (came to nz as a child) or Sivivatu (came to nz as a teenager on a soccer scholarship). Please enlighten me to a single foreign (and non-NZ raised) rugby player that NZRFU has seen playing in a pro comp somewhere and gone and offered a contract to? Hansen is right, O'Neil is typically Aussie on this one.
Posted 19:20 23rd October 2012
paulynz says...
Mind the door doesn't clip you on the arse on your way out JO...
Posted 18:42 23rd October 2012
golden_statenba says...
@Tubolardy
Add to that one englishman
I don't really care about where players play and SH and JO did not really need to bring it up.
I think people only care if the player poses a threat like Mike Harris,Jonah,Tuilagi. You don't hear people complaining about Japan and all the kiwis etc playing for them??
Fact is New Zealand have not poached many players at all unless those kids from samoa Fiji and Tonga were signed at age 1 which is
A, a big risk
B, Illegal maybe?
Also if these players really were that patriotic about their homeland they would refuse to play for any country but there land of birth.
We did not hear many people calling for Harris Digby and Cooper to be playing for the ABs and they are happy playing for Australia so thats that.
I think the poaching talk is a way for people to get a dig at fans of opposite teams as many of these posts are
If you cant get at the players get at the next best thing
The FANS!!!
Posted 17:19 23rd October 2012
notajokebok says...
Well get ready for a hell of a lot more NZ born people representing Australia !
Add South Africa to that equation also.
20,000 New Zealanders moved to Australia last year and although the South African numbers aren't that high a lot have move to Oz also.
So through time now there will be a hell of a lot of "foreign" players representing OZ !
Just get used to it.
Posted 15:23 23rd October 2012
Doyley says...
This argument is as boring as it it repetitive. Who really cares?
Posted 15:22 23rd October 2012
melkdave says...
Well J.O;Neil is definatly wrong here ,under his leadership ,the ARU has FAILED FAILED and FAILED in regards to developing home grown talant ,we know it he knows it and the australian fans know it.That being said theres nothing wrong with players pursueing their dreams and ambitions elsewhere,espically if appartently surplus to requirements at home.The question is still their though ,just where would wallaby rugby be if NZ didnt atm havre players apparently surplus to requirements,in the tiolet im sure and langrashing in 21st spot in the IRB rankings ,who knows .
Posted 14:34 23rd October 2012
Ferdie says...
Two names for JON
Henry Speight (Fiji) and Etienne Oosthuizen (SA)
Both signed as foreign development players and contracted to play for ARU - and Qantas Wallabies and make themselves ineligible for selection in their home countries - be 'prepared to one day play for Australia'.
Speight was paid/contracted NOT to play for Fiji in 2011 RWC based on a promise of selection for Qantas Wallabies from June 2013 when he meets residency.
Make that three (almost) - same contract conditions as former NZer Gamblin' Willie Ripia had with the Force - ex Taranaki, Hurricanes, NZ Maori but contracted to fill a lack of depth in Australian test rugby at #10.
It's all about local talent!!!!!!
Posted 13:41 23rd October 2012
Trinats2 says...
cuw3100:
Palu and TPN were born in Sydney (Australia)
Thanks to NZ for poaching Timani from Tonga "won a scholarship" to Auck Grammer !!! he then went to play league in Australia.
jmanngod:
Turn it up, flying Fijian !!!
Posted 13:39 23rd October 2012
Ferdie says...
cuw3100 - "IRB should allow such players to play for the smaller country even after playing for bigger country in tests"
well, contact your IRB representative.
New Zealand, supported by Australia and England, has proposed this three times in recent years.
(From NZ Herald) "In 2004, 2009 and 2011, the IRB voted against proposed eligibility changes that were designed partly to help strengthen the Pacific Island nations by allowing players to represent Tier Two Nations after a one-year stand-down if they had played for a Tier One Nation."
Wales, Scotland and Ireland vetoed the latest, 2011, proposal.
There you have it.
Posted 13:27 23rd October 2012