Set to leave the Lions den?: Josh Strauss
This week we will mostly be concerning ourselves with rumours, assertions, insinuations and accusations, observations and praise...
Bizarre goings-on in the South African media this week, with widespread reports of Lions captain and dynamo back row Josh Strauss opting to join none other than the Crusaders for next year's Super Rugby tournament (that's the one the Lions have been unfairly shovelled out of by the way).
The rumour, sparked as many credible and well-checked media stories these days are: via Twitter, proved untrue, but did have the side effect of letting us all know that wherever Strauss is next year, it's unlikely to be at Ellis Park after he confirmed that his agent is looking around at overseas opportunities.
The Strauss move was also rumoured to be a loan for a year (presumably up to the point when the Lions play the Kings and give them what for), while Elton Jantjes is also set to be loaned out to another franchise as he has a clause in his contract saying that if the Lions lose Super Rugby, Jantjes can move on.
Indeed, the Lions might have to resort to that kind of creative thinking and loan out a whole host of players. Having already lost the services of four key forward personnel and looking certain to lose Strauss, all on the back of a home defeat to the Griquas, the ship is looking decidedly unsteady in the choppy waters of SA Rugby.
Would year-long loan deals, with the players coming together for a couple of weeks before the play-off against the Kings, not be a good solution for the Lions?
Hopefully they can create something though. It would be a desperate shame to lose them from the face of SA Rugby for the longer term.
Remember the English and French clubs' reasoning for not being happy with the Heineken Cup because the Celtic teams could qualify with relative ease from the Pro12 while they had to fight tooth and nail through the arduous Premiership and Top 14?
Remember what they said about the Celtic teams being able to rest players on a regular basis, thus leaving the teams not only fresher for the Heineken Cup but also looking fresher for the Six Nations?
Well, take a look at the Pro12 this weekend. Leinster, shorn of several internationals on mandatory rest periods, were annihilated by the Scarlets. The Ospreys crumbled in Treviso, also lacking several key players.
Yet under the current qualification rules being suggested by ERC, it is infeasible to think either of these teams will not be right up there, both when it comes to challenging for the Pro12 title and especially in qualification for the Heineken Cup. A couple of domestic defeats actually don't matter.
Meanwhile, the French have been bashing lumps out of each other with full strength teams for three weeks now, while the Premiership kicked off (in style, we might add) with a reasonably full complement of internationals on show.
You see, defeats in these two leagues could see you in quite a lot of trouble when attempting to qualify for the Heineken Cup, especially with the number of teams set to be cut to 20. Finishing in the top four or five in either league is no mean feat and requires a lot more effort than finishing in the top eight of the Pro12 does.
The English and French have a point - this time ERC need to listen and think.
In France, it seems the pressure of reaching the heady goals being set is beginning to fizz in boardrooms around the country, with a couple of Presidents opening fire on the referees of games their teams lost with typical panache.
Agen's president Alain Tignaud asked that Agen be 'refereed like everyone else', adding he wanted his team to be relegated because they were 'not good enough, rather than because of injustice' (so you're confident of staying up Mr. Tignaud?)
A little more high-charged than that was Racing Metro President Jacky Lorenzetti's furious insinuation that Toulon's head coach Bernard Laporte entered the dressing room of referee Monsieur Raynal during the half-time of Toulon's 23-21 win over Racing (a match which Toulon claimed with a late penalty). Laporte claimed to be entering to ask about an alleged stamp by Dimitri Szarzewski on Chris Masoe.
Anyway, conspicuous by his absence is Toulon's own inimitable mouthpiece Mourad Boujellal. Strange... so where are Toulon these days? Ahh - of course. Sitting pretty at the top with three wins out of three. Referees are only bad when you lose. They're the easiest to blame for defeats; ironically, they're the ones you can control the least.
There's a lot of sour grapes in France at the moment, there are also still a lot of matches being decided on penalties and much indiscipline, fighting and cards.
There's no real solution other than to look at the referees and see if they really are that awful; it's worth bearing in mind, France is perhaps the toughest place in the world to referee so slack is the discipline at times. But it would be nice to see a measure of censure applied to the loudmouths on occasion.
That Australian rugby is in a bit of a rut at the moment is obvious, but how deep is becoming more and more evident.
It seems that the Rugby News publication, a weekly paper devoted to all goings-on in sub-franchise rugby is to be no more after this season, and it seems that club rugby is no longer worthy of domestic TV coverage after this year either.
This would be less newsworthy in other countries - akin to the loss of a couple of digits more than a limb - but Australia has no provincial rugby to back up the Super franchises as in South Africa or New Zealand. The downgrading of club rugby that these cuts afford is a hammer blow to the game, a real marginalisation in a country where rugby ranks a distant fourth behind rugby league, AFL and cricket.
We can only hope that something is done to help regenerate this. Without a thriving club game - including good coverage and information flow - underpinning the franchises, Australian rugby will be operating on decidedly shaky foundations and the rut they are currently in will become a lot deeper.
Finally, on a more cheery note, do not delay. Get to an internet connection, trawl the depths of the ether, and try to pick up a full-length replay of this weekend's Taranaki-Tasman Ranfurly Shield challenge/ITM Cup match.
Pace, skill, endeavour, physicality, discipline, honesty, 89 points and a stadium full of raucous fans were on offer, with barely a trace of referee sledging, fighting, indulgent squad rotation or unwelcome politics to be seen. All this between two of the country's less-decorated provinces as well.
It's taken some time to get right, but New Zealand, pioneers of a better game on the pitch for a while now, seem to be getting the administration of the game right in challenging times as well. It's creating a national rugby atmosphere where people seem happy to play and officiate, rather than scared to lose or get things wrong. It can be done.
Loose pass compiled by Richard Anderson
Comments
Monkeyboy says...
@APV1 I support the Cardiff Blues and of course, Wales. I fail to remember a time when Welsh teams ever plundered the English system for its best players, so you wouldn't understand the effect that would have on the fans. Remembering the exodus of welsh stars to league in the 80s & 90s, I saw the knock on effect of that. If as PR suggested elsewhere that there is a European wide salary cap (that isn't circumvented by unscrupulous clubs) then I'd agree that the reforms are needed. As it is the current calls are tantamount to the T14/AP clubs trying to protect more of their own at the expense of relatively newly formed regions in the Celtic/Italian fringe. I see it as them saying "We've got more money than you, so we deserve more".
Posted 19:57 03rd September 2012
whatisthis says...
At first being a leinster fan i was firmly against the aviva/top 14 argument but thinking about it this would be my solution.
I would like the HC qualification to be, the top 7 in Celtic/Aviva/Top 14 qualify automatically. In last years terms this would be:
Leinster Quins Toulouse
Ospreys Leicester Clermont
Munster Saracens Toulon
Glasgow Northampton Castres
Scarlets Exeter Montpellier
Ulster Sale Racing Metro
Cardiff L. Irish St. Francais
Now for the other 3. I would have the Amlin winner as the first: Biarritz
Next I would have either a Scottish or Italian: Treviso
And finally the winner of an eighth place play off between the Aviva/Top 14: Bath/Bordeaux
That would mean Connacht....Zebras....Edinburgh would lose out to be replaced by Bath or Bordeaux.....London Irish....Stade Francais.
A much better quality product for those whop want to be introduced to the game and in the end a much more profitable business which is still highly important in the professional era. there will be some who say you will lose the 'underdog story' but will you really? Would you expect stade or sale to really trouble the big teams??? But at least they would not be getting bet by 40 plus points. (Zebres will get smashed evey week even in the weakest pool...
Posted 18:16 03rd September 2012
sextons_on_fire says...
More anti-Irish rubbish from PR and commenters BLAH BLAH BLAH BLAH
Posted 18:02 03rd September 2012
simonokeeffe says...
I agree, Pro12 teams have more to lose financially if the HC goes.
The issue of the Italian teams is whether you agree with affirmative action, IMO European rugby in general but especially 6n needs Italian & Scottish teams competing in HC, Italian teams have come on a lot since they entered pro12 but they do need 2 stable franchises and as of now only had one
Posted 17:30 03rd September 2012
APV1 says...
@ magic_dragon - I don't think I'm right, I know it. Obviously.
I know you don't like me, which is fine. But you really do struggle to make a reasoned argument and positively contribute to the debate. We don't have to agree - that's the beauty of a debate - but a little comprehansion and understanding would serve you well. I'll lend you one of my two braincells if it helps.
I absolutely agree with you, regarding the salary cap and foreign player cap, as I've mentioned on other threads. I also mentioned that I like that the Rebels were given a little "extra", to give them time to get up to speed - sensible rule making for a change.
If you managed to comprehend other people's points of view and not just read the words, you would also realise that by making the Pro12 a more competitive league (and, as such, making the HC fairer), the quality of rugby and the success of the competing teams will improve. Have a read of my trolling-chum melkdave's post, which might help. The meaningless Pro12 is just putting off punters and getting everyone no-where fast.
And I admit that Bath were woeful this weekend, although we won - the only real positive. We selected poorly from a squad missing some key players due to injury - Flyhalf, being an obvious example. OB stepped up and did well, but he's a better 12.
@ Monkeyboy - "Stop pilfering other countries for players..." Really?! Still?! And which team and country do you support? Have a quick look at the players in there and come back to that tired old debate then. Glass houses and stones spring to mind.
@ melkdave - how's your head? Mine's quite sore from banging it against the wall - perhaps I should stop. And I can't remember who it was, but someone suggested that the SA teams should merge and from, not the Cats, but The Lion Kings. Brilliant!
@ GCP_JONES - sorry. I knew it wouldn't last.
Posted 15:48 03rd September 2012
froggy73 says...
@Siomonokeeffe: here are humble answers to your questions.
If Celts have such unfair advantages how come there's never been any Welsh finalists and only one ever Scottish semi finalist? --> simply because Welsh and Scottish clubs have always been very average until now.
No relegation and the IRFU resting players (often against the provinces wishes) did not make Northampton blow a 16 point half time lead in '11 nor Fabien Pelous get sinbinned for kicking Alan Quinlan in '08 nor Leicester lose by one kick in '09 nor Bobo desert his wing for Stringer to score in '06. 2010 was all French final and 2007 was all English --> I sincerely do not see your point there.
If we have 8 French teams in HC there'll be 4 of them that don't care about it --> That is simply because these teams (namely Racing Metro, Montpellier, Castres) do have to fight in the T14 to get a spot for next year HEC. If, like the PRO12 clubs, they could relax and only focus on the HEC, do you seriously think they wouldn't do it ??
It's the European Cup; that's why we need automatic entry for Scottish and Italian teams; top 3 out of 4 Irish and Welsh sides qualify, used to be top 2 out of 3 Scottish when Borders still existed --> if I follow you, then why not welcoming the Georgian and Russian clubs in the HEC ??
English and French clubs just want more money (if they're not going to get it by winning). English clubs can't afford to go without HC. --> As if the Irish clubs could. The day AP and T14 will be fed up to be taken for fools they will go for that Anglo-French cup and then we shall see who is has lost the most.
Posted 14:57 03rd September 2012
melkdave says...
PART 2
AS to the Lions in SA well that has been a mess from day1 ,and i still feel the best and most viable option is the reemergence of the CATS franchise where the cheetahs and Lions merge .1 year loans of playes imo just wont work.Those players are proffesionals ,and have the right to make a decent living.,with loaning out players the question arises just who pays them ,and could the Lions afford to pay even a percentage of their wages??while keeping a full Currie/ Voda squad.
As to the Tasman VTaranaki game WOW yes it was a great game and i was very lucky to watch it.It showed rugby at its best imo,and was like 2 AB teams going hammer and tongs at eachother.Please please rugby gods can we have more games of such quality,passion and intensity .If so ill be a very happy man.
Posted 14:17 03rd September 2012
Monkeyboy says...
I think you Pro12 detractors ate coming at it from completely the wrong angle. The league should really be considered as 4 national conferences which decide which regions/provinces qualify for the HC (admittedly only for the Welsh & Irish). You can't compare it to the AP or T14 because they're solely one nation leagues.
Look at the HC before the Celts realised that to compete with the financial muscle of the French & English they had to reform. Wales had to cut from 12 clubs to regions, causing massive pain. So the Scots as well. The league was a necessity to give these fewer clubs regular competition to prepare for the HC. So for the English & French to declare this gives an unfair advantage is galling. Stop pilfering other countries for players, thus denying our fans the chance to watch our stars leading to the further financial problems low attendances bring.
The other argument that to make the HC more fair is to tire out the best performing teams is just crass. I would believe that to improve a tournament was to try and improve the teams that are tired/not interested.
Take a good look at your own tournements to prepare your teams differently if you cherish winning it so much. THAT is what will lead to a better HC
Posted 14:00 03rd September 2012
melkdave says...
Well where to start.so many points to cover this week.I suppose ill start at the top,and the referee debate.
While i find the constant questioning of referees decisions a sad fact of todays game.I can understand why some managers /presidents ect get frustrated,a single refs decision these days can have very far reaching effects,both financally ,and for qualification for playoffs or HECas its that tight between the clubs in both the AP and T14,where any team can beat anyother on its day.The answer is of course MORE transparancy from referees and consistancy between them in regards to interpetation of the laws.Of course its easier said than done ,as referees are human ,individuals and not robots,and will of course make mistakes.When they do make mistakes ,managers ect i feel have to be more diplomatic shall we say ,and just except that accidents and mistakes will happen ITS LIFE after all.
As to the HEC qualification debate ,well i feel ive said more than enough elsewhere LOL,But ill just restate ,i see HEC qualification on merit as a 1st step into making the Pro12 a meaningful and revalent league, and hopefully vibrant,and to answer @Simonokeeffes point ,why do the english and french clubs have much bigger budgets,because their income is vastly more / higher from vibrant leagues,with rising attendances,where 10K+fans per match is not uncommon In constrast the Pro12 clubs have falling attendances,and the clubs lose money or breakeven and sometimes even make a slight profit from games ,thus giving them less money for their budgets.
II have also banged on for sometine about the weaknesses in Australian rugby,the lack of a clear career path for players in the union code ,and a competion for them to hone /develop their skills i feel the ARU have failed ,and Australia wont be a top 5 ranked team formuch longer in 5yrs i think ,and they will be in the 10th-15th bracket
Posted 13:58 03rd September 2012
Ramage says...
The Taranaki Tasman game was a really great game to watch and he free flowing attacking rugby was great to see. Good to see the Naki triumph but it was no done deal. Tasman took it to Canterbury the week before and beat the other pig island side and continued the same plan against the Naki. This time however they met another team also determined to play the open game. Please don't show the tape to Meyer or he might get some fresh and modern ideas of how to pl,ay the game. Congratulations to the referee who let the game flow but penalised blatant offences. The ref by the way ex Chiefs and All Black Glen Jackson. If you havent seen the game have a look at the clip on youtube that Ferdie has uploaded. The Naki coach is former Hurricans coach and Taranaki player Colin Cooper assisted by Leo Crowley Kieran's brother and the Coach of Tasman is Kieran Keane and assistant Leon MacDonald former All Blacks and Canterbury Reps. These coaches who have played and coached under he NZ system are helping to instill the fast running game atthe ITM cup level so that all of NZ is siging from the same hymn book.The new younger players are adopting the running game with gusto and some of the skills are a joy to watch. Well done Tasman and Taraaki a really enjoyable game.
Posted 13:53 03rd September 2012
magic_dragon says...
By the way,the Ospreys have a lot of injuries but fielded their strongest possible side,including several full internationals,so why even mention them? They lost due to a sending off and missing their try scoring chances,and not through picking a weakened side. Talk about PR feeding the trolls again.
Posted 13:38 03rd September 2012
jamesliveinhope says...
Good to see PR falling on the clever side of the fence.
@simon okeefe I'm pretty sure that Jim Mallinder said that much of the Northampton's fall-off in that game related to the fatigue of a long AP campaign. Leinster had also had an extra day to recuperate after their play-off semi final.
The crux of the argument is not about how easy or difficult it is for sides to win (or qualify for the Pro 12 play-offs but how easy or difficult it is to be in the hunt for it come season's end. The top 6 in the competition are only really interested in taking points off each other in the season's first half then trying to win everything in the run in. To be fair, Wasps were past masters of that tactic in their pomp but, with the salary cap taking away financial dominance and any spare money getting invested in coaching/fitness/rehab - no AP club can afford to allow the rest of the league to get away from them because they just can't guarantee their survival that way.
The issue is that, the HC will be missing Stade, Wasps, Perpignan and Bath due to their failure to qualify but will include Cardiff. Connacht, Treviso and Zebre who failed to make the top half of their league and of whom one of which not only doesn't have an ERC ranking but is listed as "Italy HC Club" in the rankings.
The secondary issue is that a draw with these teams in has meant that Quins and Biarritz are pretty well guaranteed to progress from their group whilst top quality sides in three other groups are left with uncertainty as to whether or not they will make 2nd place at all let alone pick up the second runners up berth.
Posted 13:36 03rd September 2012
APV1 says...
@ GCP_JONES - good point and thank you. I know I get a little... erm... animated (?!) sometimes. There's so much rugby to enjoy, I'm going to try to ignore the back-room bull$h!t. Not promising to succeed, but I'll have a go.
Posted 13:34 03rd September 2012
simonokeeffe says...
@AVP1 Scots and Italians part of 6 nations so that tournament (and growth of rugby in growing market like Italy) suffers if theyre not in HC, although that is not English clubs problems
Georgia/Russia don't have professional clubs and the Amlin is there for tier 3 nations if they can put clubs in
Prem clubs say HC is 20% of their income (but am sure there's variance). Anglo French cup would generate significantly less revenue (and interest from french clubs) as less tv viewers, no established brand, attraction etc so even if they lost 5-10% of their annual income that's the difference between being a profitable and loss making club
Posted 13:33 03rd September 2012
Rosbif says...
Re the HCup saga (sorry for bleating again - but this time I'm trying to see the other side!), I was just looking at Leinster's fixture list again. To be fair, given the player welfare issue which is out of their hands, there is a real risk that their 1st XV will be under-cooked for the first rounds of HCup. It's not easy bringing back all 11 players in one week after all. But if we assume their first proper game is Sep 22nd at home vs Edinburgh (who might field a B/C team - who knows?), that leaves Sep 28th at home vs Connacht (again, not necessarily expected to be a massive challenge), followed by Munster at home on Oct 6th (who might be resting players for HCup the week after? - who knows?).
It reminds me a little of NZ having too many easy pool games in RWCs (since other sides rest players against them to maximise chances of coming 2nd in their pool) and finding themselves under-cooked for QFs (e.g. 2007 obviously, but also first hour of 2011 QF).
There is a danger, for Leinster, that not getting the odd bonus point or win away from home in the first round of matches means they don't top the pool and get home QF (assuming the Clermont back-to-backs go 50/50, it all comes down to who plays better against the other teams).
Just saying. It's far from a perfect situation for Schmidt and his staff either. They can only play the hand their dealt!!
Posted 13:22 03rd September 2012
magic_dragon says...
@APV1,that's your problem,you always think you're right. So you want a level playing field do you,well lets introduce a salary cap across the whole of Europe and put a restriction on the number of foreigners teams are allowed to field during the HC,that's what I call a level playing field. Oh,and while your at it,I don't think it's fair you've got a bigger player base and more professional teams than we have,so can you reduce those as well. Seriously,you've got the cheek to say people with a couple of brain cells should see your point of view,when it's clear to me you are lacking in even that small amount. The only trolls on here are people like yourself and Melkdave,you're so wrapped up in your own little worlds you fail to see the bigger picture,and your views are the only ones that matter and anyone who disagrees with you is either a troll or stupid. The more I read your comments the more I'm embarrassed for you. PS. Yeah Bath were scintillating on the weekend,8 penalties wasn't it? Breathtaking.
Posted 13:21 03rd September 2012
powerplay says...
thanks Ferdie
Posted 13:04 03rd September 2012
heart_of_oak says...
crikey, Strauss's beard has to be the worst I've ever seen - even worse than the caveman. Is this guy planning to take over from Father Christmas ?
Some great games this week. It'll be interesting to see if Sarries maintain their attacking play throughout the season plus I hope that Ashton leaves his handbag in the training room and concentrates on fair play - no hair pulling and no show boating.
One to watch (imho) Joel Tomkins. Could be a great player for England I reckon.
Posted 13:03 03rd September 2012
GCP_JONES says...
@ Ferdie...
Nice one for the heads-up, looking forward to watching it. I need cheering up
@ Planet Rugby.....
Wow with the Heineken Cup wind-ups, at the moment we have the Pro 12 ,Top 14 Aviva,Rugby Championship, the ITM and Currie Cup, surely you could be writing about lots more besides the drawbacks and structure of European Rugby.
You have ran with the story for about 4 weeks now, at least wait until every one sits around the table to trash it out in October.
Posted 13:00 03rd September 2012
APV1 says...
@ simonokeeffe - we're coming at this from polar-opposites, so there's no surprise that we disagree. But I have to correct you on one point. The English clubs make most of their money from the AP. That's not to suggest that they make nothing from the HC, but the AP provides most of their finances. If the AP and T14 teams were to walk away and form an Anglo-French Cup (or equivalent), it would be likely that Sky and sponsors would follow. And that would be a whole lot worse for the Pro12 clubs. I agree that it is the European Cup, but your argument that it must have representation from England, France, Wales, Ireland, Scotland and Italy doesn't hold water. What about teams from Spain, Russia, Portugal, Romania, Georgia, etc..? It should be the best clubs from European rugby, regardless of where they're based.
Bath haven't made it into the HC this year because they were beaten by better teams. But is Edinburgh actually better - languishing in 11/12 in the Pro12 last season? Are the Zebras better? Who knows.
Posted 12:34 03rd September 2012