Fine finish: George Pisi
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Samoa sent Six Nations holders Wales crashing to their fifth consecutive loss after the visitors secured a 26-19 win at the Millennium Stadium on Friday.
It was the hosts' fourth negative to the islanders and followed Rob Howley's charges' defeat to Argentina at the same venue only one week ago.
Suddenly a November whitewash seems likely, with Wales now preparing to face New Zealand and Australia in their final Test series fixtures.
The visitors came out of the blocks firing as they looked to kick on from their impressive win over Canada in Colwyn Bay a week ago. And they managed to cross the whitewash within two minutes against the sterner opposition when number eight Taiasina Tuifua broke through a somewhat non-existent defence before recycled ball was moved wide to Paul Williams and then George Pisi, with the Northampton Saints centre sending over Faatoina Autagavaia on the right.
The impressive Tusi Pisi's conversion made it 0-7 with the match still very much in its infancy. For Welsh supporters, it was a moment of realisation, realisation that their Grand Slam champions were in for a big test of their credentials.
Leigh Halfpenny, who was on-form with the boot in Cardiff, pulled the hosts back to 3-7 with 16 minutes played after a ruck infringement and then cut matters down to a point on the half-hour. By this point Wales had been forced to make a change, as Richard Hibbard was hurt.
Despite their six points, Wales were not having things their own way but were the recipients of a gift from Pisi, with the fly-half throwing a suicide pass that Ashley Beck gobbled up and then set off for a 70 metre sprint to the whitewash. Halfpenny made it 13-7 with the extras.
The assured Pisi did reduce the arrears off the kicking tee with the last play of the first-half, which made the contest beautifully balanced at 13-10 with 40 minutes remaining in Cardiff.
After the turnaround the match continued to excite and when Kahn Fotuali'i scooted down the blindside at a ruck close to halfway to set up centre Pisi for a superb finish in the corner, the Samoans were ahead again. Fly-half Tusi could not add the extras however, and one wondered whether that missed conversion on 47 minutes would come back to hurt them.
An exchange of penalties from Halfpenny and Pisi then troubled the scorers as the lead changed hands five times during the second-half. Up 21-19, Samoa repelled a rare attack by Wales soon after, with the hosts struggling to make any real headway with ball in hand.
Instead it was Samoa who had the final say when David Lemi kicked ahead, Halfpenny and Autagavaia both missed the bouncing ball to hand replacement Johnny Leota a try late on.
Man of the match: A toss-up between the half-backs in blue. Let's go for Tusi Pisi's effort.
Moment of the match: The finish from George Pisi was something special. It had to be him.
Villain of the match: Maybe of a couple of let's say 'choice' tackles could make it in there but there was nothing major to write home about. Next up for the Welsh will be New Zealand.
The scorers:
For Wales:
Try: Beck
Con: Halfpenny
Pen: Halfpenny 4
For Samoa:
Tries: Autagavaia, G Pisi, Leota
Con: T Pisi
Pen: T Pisi 3
Wales: 15 Leigh Halfpenny, 14 Alex Cuthbert, 13 Ashley Beck, 12 Jamie Roberts, 11 George North, 10 Dan Biggar, 9 Mike Phillips, 8 Toby Faletau, 7 Justin Tipuric, 6 Ryan Jones (capt), 5 Ian Evans, 4 Bradley Davies, 3 Aaron Jarvis, 2 Richard Hibbard, 1 Paul James.
Replacements: 16 Ken Owens, 17 Gethin Jenkins, 18 Scott Andrews, 19 Luke Charteris, 20 Sam Warburton, 21 Tavis Knoyle, 22 Rhys Priestland, 23 Scott Williams.
Samoa: 15 Faatoina Autagavaia, 14 Paul Perez, 13 George Pisi, 12 Paul Williams, 11 David Lemi (capt), 10 Tusi Pisi, 9 Kahn Fotuali'i, 8 Taiasina Tuifua, 7 Maurie Fa'asavalu, 6 Ofisa Treviranus, 5 Filo Paulo, 4 Daniel Leo, 3 Census Johnston, 2 Ole Avei, 1 Sakaria Taulafo.
Replacements: 16 Ti'i Paulo, 17 Villiamu Afatia, 18 James Johnston, 19 tbc, 20 Tivaini Fomai, 21 Jeremy Su'a, 22 Johnny Leota, 23 Robert Lilomaiava.
Referee: Pascal Gauzere (France)
Assistant referees: Wayne Barnes (England), Jérôme Garces (France)
Television match official: Giulio De Santis (Italy)
By Adam Kyriacou
@PlanetRugbyAK
Comments
7ton says...
So seeing you persist in furthering things
If the name calling is a joke then ok very funny but note I said "I MAY not like being called..............." (note the word "May".) That is no admission and quite frankly I couldn't care about the names you have called me as it has made you look silly. Not me. LOl!
The average thing is clearly stupid and plain misleading. Seeing 1 team played 2 and the other 3 it is ridiculous to make an average out of so little games and even if we did the margin is still too small to be relevant.
If we do even things out and take the average just out of 2 games each and cherry pick a certain two then we could get the average to be the same.
It is all rather pointless and we may as well come up with a silly stat like the All Blacks have never beaten Iceland in rugby. Maybe factually correct but really stupid and of no relevance and dishonest as they never have played (and no I have not been drinking)
Glad you agree that all this is a side issue and of course we can both go on trawling things forever.
Now if you want to further the argument then go ahead but I am going to get on and enjoy my Xmas and the festive season now and don't intend to waste time explaining things in detail to you again apart from simply disagreeing.
Posted 16:17 24th December 2012
makemehappy says...
@7ton - you just had to go through everything again didn't you. So you admit you started calling me names because I called you them LOL!!!!!!!!! You applied the term dishonestly though, as you no doubt now note.
With regards to the 8 point margin, I'm happy to include it or not. The average was still lower for Wales, regardless of whether you look at 2 or 3 games or even 2 for Argentina and 3 for Wales. That is a fact. Of course presuming Argentina might have won is irrelevant.
I could trawl through these side issues (and I agree they are side issues), but it is time to move on (unless there is another argumentative response, which there doens't need to be given I'm being factual with regards to my comments above), so have a good Christmas.
Posted 11:30 24th December 2012
7ton says...
Well if you really want to just simply "agree to disagree" then why come back with a further argument to one that is just a side issue to the real one.
If you don't like being called dishonest then you surely have to take into consideration that I may not like being called a "Numpty", " An Idiot" or to be told "I linger like a bad smell" and so on.
To clear the air and without wishing to disturb your Xmas further let me explain how there can be a difference between dishonest and a straight forward lie.
You stated some time ago as part of your argument that Wales had lost to Aus by less than Argentina in recent games You could only have been referring to Wales last 2 games as in their first game of their recent Aussie tour Wales lost by 8 points which was more than either of the 2 games in the recent RC that Argentina lost by. Therefore by omitting to account for the first game with the 8 point margin you are not actually telling a lie but "cherrypicking", being economical with the truth and as the games were played within 3 weeks of each other being rather dishonest.
We can't take a proper average from just 3 and 2 games and if Argentina had played Australia in a 3rd game who is to say that they may not have even won.
As I said this is only a side issue to the real one which is that I do not think there is any justification in insulting people simply because they have a different but inoffensive viewpoint such as calling people idiots simply because they thought the Wales/Argentina result was not a surprise or upset.
Now we both have had plenty to say about that and there is no point in continuing
Therefore to agree to disagree then we simply have to do so without either of us furthering any argument (Not just me and Not just you) and while maybe saying we disagree with the others previous post just leaving it at that.
I hope you have a good Xmas as well
Posted 19:37 23rd December 2012
makemehappy says...
@7ton - I think dishonest indicates that someone would be a liar. Of course it wasn't a dishonest post. Compare 2 games or compare 3. Even if you wanted to average the scores over 3 compared with 2 for Argentina (which would be bizarre from a statistical perspective) then Wales still have a lower average. It could therefore not be a dishonest remark since it is correct. By all means dispute the relevance but not the accuracy or honesty.
Of course I disagree with several other remarks you have made in your last post, and repeat for the umpteenth time that the essence of my argument and the reasons for some of my posts lie with people making comments without any evidence. There is no sign of evidence in many peoples postsing. Something which I'm sure you will agree with.
No need to respond to the above. You probably won't agree. So have a good Christmas, and please don't argue with the above. We can simply agree to disagree.
Posted 09:20 23rd December 2012
7ton says...
Makemehhappy
Firstly I did not use the word liar but dishonest. Secondly there is no point in just looking at the last 2 games as Wales played 3 in their tour of Aus which I referred to you being dishonest as you omitted to mention that in the one game Wales lost by the biggest margin of all. And if we do look at all 3 games I fail to see how you can be correct as Wales lost by both the smallest margin and the largest margin hence me saying you had been dishonest.
Now that is just one example and in my previous post I pointed out another where you had again been dishonest and you have avoided the question I asked which was to tell me where you have ever suggested that we should "agree to disagree" WITHOUT IN THE SAME POST including abusive remarks or declarations of right/wrong
Re "Opinions/facts ref your post 07.00 13th Dec and my one 12 Dec being a response to your preceding one.
Again I never said playing at home was of no benefit but said in this case was of no real relevance.
All the above really is a sideline to the real issue and if you don't want make a fuss then why bring it up in the first place and we can go on debating this forever.
So best if we do both just get on and enjoy Xmas
Posted 21:37 22nd December 2012
makemehappy says...
@7ton - of course I had to change my comment to "your last few posts" as you had inserted another one!
Refutation time - You called be a liar with regards to the Australia margins of defeat. That is 1 thing I can prove to be incorrect. The second is that you were incorrect with regards to the relative margins of defeat. If you wish to look at the last 2 (obviously discounting Wales last game again Australia in the Autumn series), you will see that I'm correct. If you wish to look at the last 3 games, you will see that I am correct. So that's 2 pretty conclusive demonstrations of you being wrong!
If I wasn't right in relation to the above, I'd be wrong, and not a liar.
As for me claiming my opinions are facts? When did I do that? My opinions are supported by facts and therefore are more likely to be accurate than opinions that aren't based on facts.
Statistically home advantage is relevant. Of course it isn't a guarantee of a win, otherwise Taiwan might be NZ, for example.
So I chucked in a few additional comments to ensure you accepted you were wrong 3 times.
Lets not make a fuss over it though, and just wish each other a Merry Christmas. Don't you think it would be stupid to do otherwise?
Posted 09:15 22nd December 2012
7ton says...
makemehappy
You say you have nothing to apologize for and that my last few posts demand an apology by me to you?. Ha Ha what a joke! C'mon show some reason as I could well say many of your posts from almost the beginning demand an apology from you for there sheer abusiveness.
I see you have changed from "3 elements in my last post" to" last few posts"
As I said to you in my last post if you want to try and prove something then just go ahead but don't try to goad me into playing some silly little apology game.
So the ball is in your court.
.
As for your 2cnd paragraph where you say that I "finally actually understand how to end the thread" That is a further example of your dishonesty as I have alluded to you not just in my previous post but ages ago that if you want to end this then don't come back with abusive comments and/or declarations on how your right and I'm wrong
As for your 3rd paragraph do tell me where you have ever suggested that we should "agree to disagree" WITHOUT IN THE SAME POST including abusive remarks or declarations of right/wrong
Now it is Xmas and I'm sure we don't want to be bickering away through this nice time of year but if you feel you have something to try and prove about my previous post then please do go ahead. Otherwise by all means simply agree to disagree but leave out all the abuse and right/wrong declarations.
Posted 13:48 21st December 2012
makemehappy says...
@7ton - I have nothing to apologise for. Your last few posts demand an apology if I can prove you wrong. You don't appear to have the balls to say yes. Go on say 'yes'. If you don't it will clear that you have no faith in your arguments (or lack of). If you do, then it will be on the provision that you apologise (you admit that your comments might offend). The ball is firmly in your court.
You finally actually understand how to end the thread. I've been highlighting this for ages. So well done on your fourth paragraph.
I will kindly let you say goodbye to this thread if you don't want to say 'yes', and you simply what to state "Happy to agree to disagree - enjoy your rugby!" Now that isn't too bad is it? That's my generous festive offer to you!
Posted 09:13 21st December 2012
7ton says...
Well perhaps you should think about apologising yourself for all the abusive remarks you have made before you start suggesting others should apologise to you.
Try proving what you want but don't have the audacity to go on about apologies.
As for the delay in postings I would guess that editor is sick and tired of all this bickering.
The issue is very straight forward. You seem to think that people deserve to be called idiots for such things as thinking that the Wales/Argentina result was not an upset I disagree. It's as simple as that
All this could have been ended ages ago if you hadn't kept coming back with abusive comments and/or declarations on how your right and I'm wrong
Posted 01:13 21st December 2012
makemehappy says...
@7ton - I did respond some time ago, but no sign of my comments after 36 hours. Very odd!
I have a better response though. If I can prove you are wrong about 3 elements of your last post. Will you apologise and stop posting?
Posted 13:08 20th December 2012
7ton says...
makemehappy
Trouble is as I said before you always want to end things with a final insult or such things as a declaration on how your opinion is a fact whilst claiming your making neutral comments.
And! Oh dear you poor fellow finding things offensive and saying how pathetic I am resorting to making such comments.
Well that is just one example of how dishonest and hypocritical you are being. Hypocrisy and dishonesty go together. BTW you used the word "liar" I used "dishonest"
Let's see now. You have called people idiots, told people they lack intelligence and struggle to read. Told me I linger like a bad smell after just my third post. Called me a numpty and so on and on.
Take a good look at yourself mate how offensive and pathetic are those comments that you have made?. Yet you call me a disgrace
More on you being dishonest.
Like Indicating that I was saying that playing at home was no advantage at all. You twisted what I said and that is dishonest.
Saying Wales had lost to Aus by less points than Argentina had while omitting the fact that in one game Wales had lost by 8. That's dishonest.
Saying I had brought no argument to the table when I had.
Claiming you opinion is fact. That's dishonest.
It's all in the previous posts to read but maybe it's you who "struggle to read and lack intelligence"
Finding this offensive? Well if you can't take it then don't give it!
Posted 00:29 19th December 2012
makemehappy says...
@7ton - so lets agree to differ then. Something I have been supportive of all along. No proof of me lying and by the way I find it offensive and pathetic that you are resorting to making such comments. You are a disgrace.
Posted 13:10 18th December 2012
7ton says...
makemehappy
pretty obvious re "the thread" and one only has to read the previous posts to see where you've been dishonest.
From my view you certainly haven't justified calling people idiots for simply having such a non offensive view as thinking the Wales/Argentina result was not an upset..
No doubt by your strange logic you will continue to insist that they are idiots but then on that basis and taking into account your own silly comments and assumptions re Wales losing to Australia by less points than Argentina you would be quite justified in calling yourself an Idiot! LOL!
Posted 21:53 17th December 2012
makemehappy says...
@7ton - sorry, forgot to add - you really do need help. What is that "thread" comment. Seeking clarification where required is perfectly reasonable. Only an idiot would think otherwise.
Posted 13:22 17th December 2012
makemehappy says...
@7ton - so I'm lying now am I lol! Don't see where, so don't make things up please.
Glad you acknowledge that I can call people idiots. I'm happy that I've more than justified my original stance, so I think we can therefore end this discussion, don't you?
Posted 13:20 17th December 2012
7ton says...
OH really !What a absolute stupid and dishonest post of yours that is. At least you have stopped your silly thread nonsense.
I never said playing at home wasn't an advantage but indicated that Argentina had plenty of experience at playing away. Home advantage does not make a team clear favourites and in fact Argentina lost to Australia by less playing away in Aus then they did at home.
As I said before about Wales losing by less to Aus than Argentina. They were all close games and the small margins of no real relevance
Argentina lost by 6 points and 4 points to Aus
Wales lost by 1 point 2 points and the biggest of all 8 points
Now for you to try to use these SMALL MARGINS in working out which team is likely to beat the other is plain stupid and one has to ask if it is not you that is an "Idiot". BTW Don't complain about being called an idiot after all the abuse you have given out.
As for the last game as I pointed out Argentina had picked up a lot of experience since that game by playing in the RC.
As for your statement where you say "I still can't see why you can't call an idiot an idiot" you know very well that is not the argument at all as the argument is simply about you not being able to justify calling posters idiots simply because they didn't think the result was an upset.
Now I have pointed this out to you time and time again and given plenty of reasons as to why some people may not think the result was an upset.
It is all there in the previous posts for you to see and I do not intend wasting any more time explaining things to you.
Posted 12:49 16th December 2012
makemehappy says...
@7ton - that's such a wonderful non-existent argument. So people who play all over Europe don't have experience difficulties when playing away LOL!!! Hysterical!! Glad you watched Argentina play. You therefore saw that Wales lost to Australia by less too. Great stuff and supporting my argument all the way.
I still can't see why you can't call an idiot an idiot - no argument from you there I'm afraid.
So you think the last game was irrelevant hey - weren't the teams broadly similar?? Yip!!!
As ever the rest of your comments add nothing and get real - I'm the one talking sense.
Do you now note how dull your posting about the Argentina game was. Unlikely yet likely is in essence what you said. Again, absolutely hysterical!!!!!!!!!!
Posted 09:23 16th December 2012
7ton says...
continued
Home advantage is a factor but as I said many of the Argentine players are used to playing in European venues
Now I did say in a previous article that prior to the game I thought Wales were SLIGHT favourites ( more out of optimism being a Welsh supporter) but also said I realised the potential Argentina had to earn themselves a well deserved victory.
As I pointed out in my post 00.33 of 29 Nov there is a big difference in slight favourites and clear favourites
Now we can go on and on about reasons to predict a result but as I pointed out in that post Where a team are clear favourites and lose then we can say that it is an upset. Obviously you believed Wales were clear favourites so for you it was an upset and that is fair enough. However others thought Wales were far from clear favourites, just slight or 50/50 and some thought Argentina would win so for them it wasn't an upset and they were quite entitled to say that in the previous article.
As I have said I understand that for you the result may have been an upset and I do not have a problem with that but I fail to see why you should have a problem with people who thought it wasn't to the extent of calling them "idiots"
Contrary to what you said in your last post I have reminded you that that is what the argument is about on quite a few occasions.
As for your last paragraph that is really just describing most of your own posts
Posted 01:19 16th December 2012
7ton says...
makemehappy
This "what thread" business is just another of your silly diversions and really the question should be asked of you-Why can't you see the obvious? None the less I will make things very simple for you. In your post 13:12 of 13 Dec. this is what you dishonestly stated " Still no sign of you producing an argument in relation to your initial comments about wales v argentina, now is there!" Those were your words and I responded in my post 19:16 13 Dec. by telling you to read the 3rd paragraph of my post 01.22 28th Nov. Now just to make things even more simple for you here is the part of that paragraph which demonstrates that I had produced an argument- " Having watched Argentina play a lot recently I could foresee the quite likely situation of them winning. Along with a strong forward pack they had come from a learning experience from the RC. Also the players were used to playing in European venues and in my view had plenty of potential to win The Welsh regions were not performing that well in the HC and compounded with the problem of players being outside of Wales the whole set up looked disorganised." Now surely you are not that stupid that you needed me to give you the actual sentence numbers as well as the paragraph.
In regards to your 2cnd paragraph of your last post. I never said you had produced no argument. I said that you had produced no EFFECTIVE argument that justifies calling people idiots simply because they did not think the Wales/Argentina game was an upset.
As to your reasoning the difference between the scoreline against Aus. was small and of no real relevance.
In regards to rankings as Argentina and Wales play in different comps we can't take too much notice of the difference between the two and the last time you refer to when Wales beat Argentina was over a year ago.
---- out of space to be continued---------
Posted 01:14 16th December 2012
makemehappy says...
@7ton - I can guess which thread, but it is impossible to be certain without looking through a couple. You know that, so I again ask you "which thread!"
I have responded to your argument and you know it, so don't be stupid. I will (unlike you) remind you of the argument. The comment was based on people not providing an arugment. Wales results had been better (in terms of scoreline) against Australis than Argentina, Wales were playing at home (always helpful), Wales were higher in the rankings, and Wales beat Argentina very comfortably in their last game. I still haven't seen any argument to suggest it wouldn't be an upset if they one. Indeed I believe that you acknowledged Wales would be favourites though irrationally you conclude that Argentina winning wouldn't then be an upset. It is comments such as that that I find to be stupid.
The rest of your post is the usual old rubbish. Trying to deflect your incompetencies back onto supposed confusion.
Posted 10:31 15th December 2012